Comments on: Keep your channel faders low and the Master at 0db!

By: Turdler

Turdler — Wed, 09 Jan 2013 02:04:02 +0000

I think the -12dB rule applies more to not overdriving any of the plugins you use for processing a sound. e.g. eq’s, compressors, reverbs, ect… If you’re using vsti synths, samplers, drum machines, make sure the output on the actual plugin is not redlining. Because if you slap a eq, or some other dsp device after it more than likely the input level it’s receiving is not of desired level and not optimized to work within those limits. Lower the source output, if you’re doing busy electronic music make sure you high pass eq anything that is not bass, and drums. Actually you should even slap a highpass on those as well, there’s lots of unnecessary frequency content below 30hz that eats up a lot of headroom “loudness” and makes the bottom end flabby and undefined. If your kicks, snares and other percussion is lacking punch, try layering them. One 808 type kick with the highs cut out, another kick with a more pronounced attack and scoop out all the lows on it. Try changing the pitch of them and fine tuning the start points on either to get them hitting together well then compress and final eq to glue them together. Same goes for bass and other instruments like piano as well. This isn’t some concept that is only utilized in dance music. Recording engineers have been doing this for decades in rock, pop, and other popular styles of music. If you listen to any stems from popular artists of the past there’s more than enough layers that make up the whole. With all that said, make sure your composition isn’t a jumbled up mess as well. All of this is something i’m still working on, but improving on day to day.

By: Mike

Mike — Thu, 30 Aug 2012 22:18:33 +0000

I didn’t read all the comments, but you mention over-driving the plugins. I agree about the levels but the faders are post gain so am I incorrect for thinking the gain staging of the plugins would not be affected by moving the faders?

By: Marcel

Marcel — Tue, 06 Mar 2012 01:21:03 +0000

Hmmm. I’ve been doing these exact techniques in Logic Pro 9. I’m certain they apply there as well. I’m gonna remix and totally master my next track in Ableton Live, w/Ozone 5, though as I’ve been using the ultra system demanding Logic Pro and not without a little pain and I’ve yet to try it all from the ground up in Ableton Live which is where I write everything anyway. Been spending years, not that many, exporting all the stems to Logic Pro for total mastering. Ableton Live is my first DAW love. Thanks again Dubspot for the incredible tips. Let’s see what happens. Let’s make those tracks cleaner and louder!

By: mastering dance music

mastering dance music — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 10:23:55 +0000

At 24 bit 0VU on a large format analogue console is at approx -18dBFS on a DAW meter, this is where an SSL or NEVE console would operate at. 0VU = +4dBu or 1.23 volts. So when your mix peaks at -18dBFS on your stereo output meter on your DAW you are at the same electrical level as would have been found on an SSL or NEVE desk !

Peaking near or at 0dBFS is a very high electrical level at the analogue output of a typical £100 – £200 sound card.

Do this :

Operate at 24 bit, peak your kick drum or snare at -18dBFS when you start your mix then you will have plenty of headroom and not approach 0dBFS in most mix downs. Your monitoring will be cleaner as well as the tiny opamps will not be as close to their working limits. (i.e. adding distortion to what you hear)

cheers

By: Michael

Michael — Thu, 22 Sep 2011 19:29:36 +0000

Hi Oliver,

just found out about this article and it’s indeed very helpful.
But I do have a few question; I’d like to know how you (or other people) handle their drum-rack in Ableton.
Do you really keep every sample you load into the drumrack at -12db? And what will you say is the highest db level you can use for the best sound/dynamics?
How do you place the fader on your mixer for the drum rack? also at -12db or do you keep this at 0db?

grtz
Michael

By: Mike

Mike — Mon, 14 Feb 2011 08:38:25 +0000

Following this advice causes the exact opposite of the problem for which ive been searching the answer.
I imported a reference wav file to my DAW.
The imported wave file looks almost like a solid block of audio: it is up at around maybe -.01db HOWEVER: it sounds gorgeous.
Conversely, MY bounced mix looks like it is half as high: the loudest area is at about -6db or so. When i bounced my wav out of Live It sounded VERY loud.
The mindwrecking yearslong riddle is:
Even though Live’s meter says “-0.1db”, and my ears say “ok that’s got to be as loud as a mixdown should be”, the rendered wav file is at -6db. And when played in ipod or in my car, i have to turn the volume on the ipod all the way to hear anything.
It keeps me awake at night, and ive given up hope trying to figure it out.

By: dylabs

dylabs — Mon, 07 Feb 2011 02:09:27 +0000

i recently applied a similar principle to my hardware recordings
i record my gear a lot quieter (around -12 to -16db) and makes mixing much easier

By: litekicks

litekicks — Wed, 12 Jan 2011 01:21:56 +0000

@Mongrand thumbs up for the info!

By: casey

casey — Tue, 04 Jan 2011 05:11:46 +0000

vintage warmer works magic on kicks as well.

By: Mongrand

Mongrand — Mon, 08 Nov 2010 14:29:43 +0000

@litekicks :

Use your kick drum signal to sidechain compress your bass signal. When a kick hits, it will trigger comp on your bass track, making room for kicks and avoiding bass frequencies overload. That should do the trick, try it with an average threshold, but a strong ratio, reasonable sidechain attack time (ie about 50 ms) and a long release (somewhat between 70 and 120 ms).
A long release time gets you a pumping effect on the bass track; quicker release gives you room for your kicks, but you won’t notice the compression triggering at each kick drum. You’ll get to hear the kick clearly, and you’ll get a clear bass when kicks are not hitting.

Here’s how to do it in details http://www.reasontutorials.net/2009/04/side-chain-compression-reason-tutorial/

Also, try focusing on your mixing before thinking of limiting / mastering your track. Limiting your master bus only prevents master clipping. Kick / Bass issues often come from frequencies clashes (bass frequencies are much more quick to saturate, so that a kick and a bass, even at lower volumes, are likely to sound muddy if unprocessed) rather than level ones. To avoid it, make sure your bass makes room for your kicks (or the inverse, depending on what style you’re mixing down – I assume it’s dance music); for instance, with your kick signal triggering a sidechain compression on your bass track.